Travel Trends with Dan Christian
#1 B2B Travel Podcast. If you are looking to stay ahead in the travel industry, this new podcast hits all the highlights! The Travel Trends Podcast is where industry leaders converge to share & shape the future. Whether you're an emerging entrepreneur, a seasoned industry executive, or a dedicated travel professional, you’ll be able to stay ahead in a rapidly evolving landscape.
Uncover valuable insights, innovative strategies, and meaningful connections that will elevate your travel business or career to new heights.
Travel Trends with Dan Christian
Spotlight Episode: The Travel Coach Network with Sahara Rose De Vore
Imagine travel not merely as an escape, but as a powerful catalyst for healing, transformation, and self-discovery. This is the groundbreaking vision Sahara Rose De Vore has brought to life through her pioneering work with the Travel Coach Network.
Sahara’s journey began with a hospitality degree and a one-way ticket to Europe, igniting a decade-long adventure across 84 countries. Along the way, her personal battles with anxiety and depression unveiled the profound therapeutic potential of travel. This revelation inspired her to create the world’s first ICF-accredited travel coaching certification program.
Today, the Travel Coach Network has grown to include over 700 coaches spanning more than 40 countries. These coaches offer a revolutionary approach to travel - one that transcends booking itineraries and accommodations. Instead, they guide clients in using travel as a tool for personal growth, healing from trauma, rediscovering themselves, and uncovering their purpose. It’s a transformative shift in how we approach travel, focusing on the traveler’s inner journey rather than just external destinations.
This episode explores the profound healing power of travel. Ready to see how your next trip could transform more than just your surroundings? A big thank you to Sahara for sharing her inspiring vision with us!
The #1 B2B Travel Podcast Globally. Over 100 Episodes. Listeners in 125 countries. New Episodes Every Weds. Season 6 launches in September.
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Overall, we're going to see people turning to travel as, like I said, a source of like therapy, a source of connection, a source of healing, whether they book an intentional wellness trip through you know what we see in the wellness travel on these different websites and booking sites or just to get away, and you know, go on an explorer or go on a multi-generational trip, and the benefits of what that can do for us as well. All fall under these umbrellas of wellness.
Speaker 2:Hello everyone, and welcome to a special spotlight edition of Travel Trends. This is your host, Dan Christian, and today we're going to be speaking to the founder and CEO of the Travel Coach Network, sahara Rose DeVore. Now Sahara is a true trailblazer in the travel industry, and I don't use that word often or lightly, but in her instance, it is the most appropriate way to explain what she's accomplished, because this is an individual who's been a TEDx speaker recognized as one of the most influential women in travel. By Travel Pulse, she's traveled to more than 84 countries solo, and she has built the Travel Coach Network from scratch to become the number one coaching and education platform globally for transformative and wellness travel two of the biggest trends in the travel industry. So I was so keen to have Sahara join us for this.
Speaker 2:They now have 700 coaches in more than 40 countries and have paved an opportunity for many people to work in the travel industry and also realize roles that they didn't even know existed, as we get into in our conversation today, because this is a way of using travel as a medium for healing, self-discovery and transformation, and I know how important that is to many of our listeners. So you're going to hear some really valuable advice from Sahara today. They now have more than 15,000 members globally and they have gone from strength to strength, so it's a real pleasure to bring Sahara onto the Travel Trends podcast, to be able to share her story of building the Travel Coach Network and her passion and interest in travel. I think you're going to really enjoy this conversation. So, sahara, thanks so much for joining us and welcome to Travel Trends.
Speaker 1:Oh, thanks, dan, so much for having me. I'm really excited to talk with you today.
Speaker 2:Well, two people that are so passionate about travel, I'm surprised that we haven't met before. So this is actually, for our listeners, the first time that we've actually been properly introduced, and I'm sure we'll see each other at various places or events around the world at some stage. We'll see each other at various places or events around the world at some stage. But one of the reasons I really wanted to speak to you is that you are an avid traveler. I know you studied hospitality in school and then you went traveling and so and you spent a number of years and I believe it's 84 countries, is that right? You've been to yeah.
Speaker 2:Amazing. So tell us a bit about that, like what started your passion for travel, why did you decide to study hospitality in school, and then what led you to embark on really kind of a decade of incredible global travels.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I wasn't someone who traveled much growing up. Our extent of traveling was packing into the family van and driving from Wisconsin down to southern Texas and then over the border to Mexico, which is where my grandmother was from, to visit her family, and then also doing the same thing, but up to Canada, the French region, which is where my grandfather was from. But I was so young I barely remember bits and pieces of that, and no one in my family traveled for business. We didn't take big vacations or anything, so travel was never something that crossed my mind. I was also someone who never knew exactly what I wanted to do for a career path either. When I graduated high school, I didn't know what I wanted to study in university. Luckily, for the first couple years of university you can try out different topics and subjects.
Speaker 1:It was my third year university.
Speaker 1:I was moving from ASU for a few years and then I was moving back to the Midwest at a small window of time to find a school to transfer to, and I came across a hospitality and tourism program in a school in Chicago and I said travel, who doesn't like to travel?
Speaker 1:Right, I wanted to do that one day. So I got into the program and it was the very first day in my international tourism course that I was really inspired by all the foreign exchange students that were in my program and they were from Europe and Southeast Asia To hear how easy it was for them to travel to as many places that they've gone to. It just blew my mind and something inside of me. I said I'm going to figure out a way to travel once I graduate. So I had two years left of school and I didn't know how I was going to do that. I was a broke college student living in the expensive city of Chicago and through changing my money mindset and really hustling my butt off, I was able to save enough and after graduation I packed my first bag, bought my one-way ticket to Europe and I started then.
Speaker 2:Amazing. Well, I was very curious to know where you started.
Speaker 2:So Europe, obviously, yes, you started in Europe but, your travel continued for years, so I'd love to hear a little bit more about how that continued after Europe, because a lot of people obviously travel to countries that they're intrigued by but also are more comfortable traveling to first, and you get further and further out of your comfort zone. Was that more or less how you started to travel? Were you a global nomad for several years, or did you come back and then just keep traveling? How did you build up?
Speaker 1:to 80 countries.
Speaker 1:So I obviously did not start off thinking I was going to travel for 10 years to 80 countries. So part of my story is that I've always struggled with anxiety and during the last couple of years at university, I was also experiencing a bout of depression and I was just not at a place of happiness. I am 22 years old. I just finished school Now. Now, what, what do I do? Who am I? I didn't have all these answers and I was feeling a lot of pressure and so I back.
Speaker 1:Then there was year rail passes, so I'd heard about this thing called backpacking Europe before. So that's why I thought of Europe and I bought a year rail pass. It was good for a month and a half and I thought I was going to. My plan was to go for the month and a half, come back and then figure out my life right, Find a company, work my way up, get a good salary, get a good title and whatnot. But I knew that going into the corporate world was not going to feed my unhappiness that I was already experiencing.
Speaker 1:And I got bit by the travel bug during that trip in Europe and I was loving how travel was making me feel and just everything that I was experiencing. So I decided when I came back after that trip it was for the holidays I saw my mom, I repacked my bag, I booked a one-way ticket to Costa Rica. I've been very drawn to the jungle and the animals and the plants, so I always had Costa Rica in my mind. So I went to Costa Rica and then backpacked my way all the way through Central America and from then on it was nonstop going home, going on trips, coming home, going on trips for the next decade.
Speaker 2:That's incredible and so fast forward to our conversation today in this incredibly successful business that you've created, the Travel Coach Network, which I'm also keen to learn more about and share with our listeners. So how did you make that transition? So you were an avid traveler, so tell us the founding story of the travel coaching network and how you decided to kind of make this.
Speaker 2:You kind of really moved on to being an entrepreneur, so it was never about the corporate world for you, so I'd love to hear more about how that journey came to be.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I, even though I had a degree in hospitality and tourism management when I graduated in 2010,. And I started my travels and really started realizing how much I was enjoying my travels and what it was doing for me and how going into the corporate world I knew was not going to make me happy and having someone tell me when I could go on a vacation was not going to satisfy me. And even though I had this degree and all this knowledge and experience in travel, I really struggled for a very long time to figure out what do I want to do for a career with this? I traveled during a really prime time in the travel industry. There was the rise of travel technology and social media and the impact that they had on the tourism industry. So there were new roles like travel blogging and influencers and all these new travel tech companies, something I still struggled. I didn't want to do any of that stuff. It never really interested me to plan trips, book trips or write about travel and I said there has to be something more. And I gave myself to the age of 30. I said when I'm 30, I will take this serious and I will figure out my life. In the meantime, I'm going to enjoy my travels, and that's what I did.
Speaker 1:I 30 came about, I bought a laptop for the first time to start traveling with it, and I was sitting in the north of Spain, in Bilbao, in my hostel in the community area, and I opened up my laptop and started Googling how to start an online business, because I figured I didn't find what I was looking for. I guess I'll have to create it myself. I don't know what that looks like and how to do this, but I'll figure it out. And as I was researching how to start a business what's happening in the travel space, just business in general Facebook caught on to me and started pushing ads for business coaches, and this is the very first time I was exposed to the coaching world business life, wellness, health coaches. I was like, wow, this is a really booming industry. I want to be a travel coach.
Speaker 1:I didn't see it anywhere, I didn't hear about it, didn't care. It just felt right to me, and so I started in 2018. I said what kind of travel coach do I want to be and what does this business look like? So I wanted to focus in wellness in the corporate space and business travel space. And as I was building that early the next year, in 2019, I founded the Travel Coach Network after others reached out to learn more about hey, what is travel coaching? Where'd you learn about it? I might want to do it, I might be already doing it didn't know the word, and then that was the catalyst.
Speaker 2:That's fascinating. I know there's so many things that I want to ask you. Obviously, you've got a book, You've been a TEDx speaker, You're one of the most influential women in travel, you belong to Travel Massive and have your own chapter there in Milwaukee. So there's so many questions I have for you. But specifically on the Travel Coaching Network because there are many you've got programs and courses and events and you've got your own podcast, so tell us how that evolved. So did it start simply with yourself? Because obviously you can now hire coaches. You've got multiple members on your team, so tell us a little bit more about what the Travel Coach Network offers.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So as I was building my wellness travel coaching business, I was figuring out what does the Travel Coach Network look like, and I gathered all the research I was doing and everything that I was learning about coaching and business and I was putting it into a course. That course, over the years, evolved into what is now our world's first and only ICF-accredited certification program for travel coaches and it's our flagship program that has over 530 members as of today in it and that is essentially our bread and butter. That teaches people how you're passionate about travel. You want to start a business in travel coaching. What does that look like? Who do you want to serve? How do you want to structure that and really creating a travel business that is authentic and meaningful to them? Because travel means something to each and every one of us and who and how we want to help people looks different for every business owner as well.
Speaker 2:So tell me, when someone looks to engage with you or your team and they're looking to hire a travel coach because I know you have the option to become a travel coach or hire a travel coach Tell us who is hiring you as a travel coach. Is it travel advisors? Tell us a bit more about the accreditation that you've developed and who it's intended for. Who's the target customer for that program?
Speaker 1:apps to develop courses for travel managers on educating on these various wellness benefits of travel beyond gym spas, yoga retreats and wellness centers. A more holistic approach, but in the Travel Coach Network, because there are so many different travel coaches who focus on different niches. They work with anything from families to solo women of a certain age Maybe it's during a life transition or career transition. We have people focus on sabbaticals. We have travel coaches who help women use travel as a way to find themselves, find their happiness after loss of their partner or their children or going through grief or trauma. So it's very specific individuals with a very specific pain point who is working with our travel coaches, because that's how specific their niches get.
Speaker 2:That's really interesting. So I certainly see the wide variety of applications for hiring a travel coach and I sort of had some understanding, but I wanted to hear it from you. I guess the other part is the types of people that might be attracted to becoming a coach. Clearly you've paved the way for many others, and so if someone's listening to this now, trying to understand that there's actually a role like this and resonating with them like it did for you when you first came up with the idea.
Speaker 2:Talk us through who that profile would typically be. What are you finding the people that are taking the programs and coming into being a travel coach? What are their backgrounds? What are you finding the people that are taking the programs and coming into being a travel coach? What are their backgrounds? What are their interests?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's really actually very interesting of how diverse the backgrounds are. We have everyone in the Travel Coach Network in our program who have backgrounds ranging from other types of coaching like life coaching, health or wellness coaching, of course, travel agents. That has been a big thing during and post-pandemic. A lot of travel agents advisors have come into the Travel Coach Network to learn how they can combine travel coaching into their business or transition over to being a travel coach. What we hear from them in particular is that they felt like there were not any other options in the industry that were available if they had a passion for travel and wanted to help others travel than to plan and book trips. But it didn't align with them and that's something that I resonated with. That's something I was not interested in.
Speaker 1:I did not want to do, but wanted to take my expertise and love of travel and help others in a different way. We have everyone from medical experts we have psychologists, we have pharmacists in our program as well learning how they can combine travel with how they work with their clients and serve their clients, and it's something they tell me that they have done, but they never put much emphasis on it. They just knew they believed in the power of travel so they would integrate it into how they work with their clients, but they never actually made it part of their business models until they found us. So people who genuinely come to the Travel Coach Network tell us they've been looking for a way to really take what travel has done for them, how it has transformed them, what they believe in so deeply about travel and now they can help others in a specific way.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's really interesting. And tell us just a little bit more on where you've gotten the business to today, because I also want to get into your book, because I have a few questions on that. But if we think about the Travel Coach Network in 2025 and your business going forward, where have you built it to and where are you headed next?
Speaker 1:Yeah, a lot of really exciting things are in store. Like I said, we have over 500 members in our flagship program now, but our private community on Facebook we have just under 4,000. We have a global community of over 10,000 across all of our platforms and it continues to grow. We have members in 40 plus countries. I actually really like that. We had a recent member from joined from Kenya, and then we also had one about a month prior joined from Romania, and we like to set people up with accountability partners in our program and they were accountability partners. So the woman from Kenya just went over to Romania to meet in person and sent me a picture, went over to Romania to meet in person and sent me a picture, and just seeing that support and the community that we've built really sets my soul on fire, because I tell them all the time what I'm building is not for me, it's for each and every one of them to really create a business that brings them so much joy and in a way that they can impact others.
Speaker 1:Where we're going is we are translating our flagship program into other languages. So we have our very first one, which is Spanish, going to be launching very soon. We're going to be developing a whole side to wellness travel into our network as well. We're always dabbling around with what AI is going to look like for our travel coach network too. So some cool ideas that I have for that. We have a membership club that continues to grow too. I love to provide opportunities for those who may not be interested in the certification program or not ready for that, but they can still get a taste of the travel coaching world and how they can integrate it into what they do coaching world and how they can integrate it into what they do. So we're always doing a lot of really exciting things and we just have a really big picture and vision for what we're building.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's so exciting. Good for you, it's, yeah, it's. You know, you're so well spoken, you're very articulate, you're a passionate traveler, and so I can fully already understand why so many people are drawn to be a part of your network. But certainly the other thing I wanted to dive into is your book, because one of the books that inspired me many years ago even though it's still a bestseller is the 4-Hour Workweek Tim Ferriss, who I still follow his podcast. But it wasn't a travel book, but for people who love travel, the idea of doing a 4-Hour work week is pretty appealing, and there were certainly some really insightful suggestions in there.
Speaker 2:And I know your book is targeted towards 20-something females that are looking to create the ideal travel lifestyle At least that's my understanding. I was checking. I know it's available on Amazon called hey you Just Go. I was reading some of the reviews in advance of our call, but I would really love to hear the backstory on that. I mean, I guess it is your story. Clearly, is it connected to the coaching business or was this sort of just a separate initiative that you'd always wanted to write a book and had a story to share?
Speaker 1:Yeah, thanks for asking. Sometimes I forget that I wrote a book. So it was the very first thing that I did in my business, even when I was still traveling, I was writing this book. So what I did was when I started traveling. I traveled back when I had a flip phone that didn't turn on for service and a paper map to navigate with and I had a pay to use computers and Wi-Fi and my hassles back in the day. So travel blogging wasn't a very popular thing yet, but blogs were something and I started a travel blog just to let my mom know where I was and that I was okay in the world.
Speaker 1:And I didn't turn anything out into my blog. I didn't promote it, didn't monetize it, didn't do anything. But I was tracking the analytics on it, which you can easily do on Blogspot, and I saw that the most popular blog posts that I had were two pretty similar ones, and one was called how to Travel the World when you Can't Afford it, and another was a very similar title. They were far more viewed than any of the other topics and I said, well, because I'm not promoting this, people must organically be searching for this and finding it. So I took that blog post and I essentially it was a skeleton to my book. I just filled it and updated it with so much more information, so I created it into my travel coaching book, where I wanted to empower, inspire, educate and provide my advice and tips in every way, shape or form for people to learn how they can travel on their own time frame, on their own budget and when they feel like they can't travel, but to show that travel is possible for them is possible for them.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's fascinating.
Speaker 2:So that's a helpful context for me, because I actually was thinking about a few people I'd like to get this book for.
Speaker 2:I guess obviously it'd make a perfect gift for, for example, I was having dinner with a colleague last week and he's the CEO of Red Carnation Hotels and his wife, and they came to Toronto for the first time and we went out for dinner and we were talking about their two kids. Our twins are teenagers there's our 23 and 21 and their daughter, who's 21, is got the travel bug, just like many of us had and obviously you had and she's going to Australia and her mom was telling me how nervous she is for her going because she's really afraid she's not going to come back, she's going to fall in love with Australia and never come back, and so she's got her working holiday visa and I was thinking this is like a perfect book for her. So tell me if I'm on the right track, if that is the case, and are you still kind of active with promoting the book, given the importance, I guess, of the subject matter?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, my book is like I said. It is every single thing that I did to be able to travel to as many countries as I did on my own budget, without ever running out of money or feeling like I had to stop traveling. So I was able to create my dream lifestyle and more, and so that is what I put into there. Yeah, it's a book that I talk about during the holidays or whenever. Every now and then I do have someone on my social media team who's so sweet and I think she recently posted about it for me, um, so if you do see posts about it, usually it's from her, um, but yeah, it's a really great. It's a mindset book, too, which is really important for for travelers, because we can face loneliness, we can have a lot of travel limiting beliefs and fears, and that's something that, once we are able to push through, we really can create a lifestyle and enjoy the travels in a way that otherwise it would hinder us.
Speaker 2:That's perfect. Thanks for the suggestion.
Speaker 2:I'm going to order it for her after our conversation, or I'm going to order it for them to give to her and, um, but yeah, then the other thing I want to ask you too, is your TEDx talk. I mean, clearly you're a very inspiring speaker. Uh, people are watching this, I'm sure are going to wonder what the hats are in your background, like you were, like you clearly live, travel, and I'm sure people listening to this. It just comes across, uh, so naturally. But, um, how did the TEDx talk come about? And just full disclosure. I haven't watched your TEDx talk yet. I definitely will afterwards, but tell us a little bit more about that journey to get a TEDx talk and what you discussed in that talk.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thanks for asking. I actually applied. Doing a TEDx talk was always on my bucket list for business and I actually applied to do a TEDx talk years ago and nothing came about from it. So it wasn't until more recently when I saw that there was an opportunity, for TEDx was coming into a local university that we have here, and I heard about it and I applied and their topic was around community. So I was going to have to tailor my topic of travel with community, which is not hard to do, so my topic ended up becoming how travel can help us build happier and more united communities both inside and outside of the workplace. And I got accepted with it and I ended up reading the TEDx book to help prepare for it and it was very exciting, nerve-wracking but rewarding experience.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's great. Certainly I think that would have been an accelerant, I'm sure, for you with the business, the book, and it's a perfect channel for you, given how effective you are as a public speaker and you've built that into your profile as well, as I understand. So do you do a number of speaking engagements globally. Are you kind of brought in as a keynote speaker for certain travel industry events?
Speaker 1:Yes, so primarily in wellness travel. So I really built a lot of my ground in the business travel industry so I've spoken at GBTA, the Global Business Travel Association, for their local chapters, many of their chapters all around the and in my home state in Wisconsin, which was pretty cool in green Bay, um. The one of the latest ones I did last year right before having my son I was um was for travel leaders, their executive uh forum, and it's all about wellness travel and my unique take on wellness travel and how business travelers can really tap into the power that travel can provide us for our well-being versus leading us to burnout like the epidemic was happening pre-pandemic. A lot of very random events I speak for, whether it's travel agent events, travel blogging events as well. We host our own events as well in the Travel Coach Network and for women travelers. I'm actually speaking at an event tonight in my local hometown for local business owners talking about visibility, which is something I just love talking about as well.
Speaker 2:So yeah, no, that's great, Given you've got so many things on the go and you focus on wellness.
Speaker 2:That's one of the things I wanted to ask you is that you know, from being a podcast host and author of TEDx speaker, running a coaching business, how do you balance? And now you've just obviously highlighted to you've got a young son, so congratulations. That's an exciting next phase of life and our commitment, my wife and I, when we had our twins, was that we were just going to take them with us, because we were such avid travelers and when we had read a book that told us that really you only need to be grounded for six weeks and as it turns out, it's more like the first three months but we took our kids everywhere and that was sort of we just decided they're just going to come along with us, and so maybe we'll come back to that one. But I wanted to ask you, just in terms of being one of the more influential women in travel and having so much on your plate, how do you manage that from your own personal wellness?
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, it took a while to learn and I'm still learning, but I'm really good at compartmentalizing things, so I am able to tackle a lot of projects based off my organizational skills. I've always been able to organize really well, whether it's physically around the home or my to-do list for my business. So I think that skill being able to just organize everything and I think I also have a bit of ADD because I'm able to, or ADHD because I'm able to juggle many things at once that would probably overwhelm a lot of people. So I just have always been a hustler when it comes to work and everything. So that has made it really easy for me to do the projects that I'm all working on while also managing my seventh bundle to continue to grow and evolve every day and now rolling over and becoming more mobile.
Speaker 2:That's great, exactly as you'll need to be, but, yeah, having a strong work ethic. I've certainly seen that in my corporate journey and entrepreneurial journey. There are certain people that can excel in corporate environments but many times they thrive so much better in an entrepreneurial setting because they are so much more accustomed to just taking the initiative and that can help you rise up in the corporate world. But, in terms of being really successful, you don't want to be someone that is being directed and told what you have to do. You really want to be able to embrace opportunities, seize them and do a whole variety of things that you're across and they obviously complement each other. So, yeah, terrific to hear that and obviously really impressive to hear your story and your journey.
Speaker 2:I mean, given all of that, you clearly have a great understanding of where the industry is today and where it's heading today. And where it's heading and one of the themes, as you know, with our podcast and in season four and having you a part of the travel advisors and wellness discussion, is this concept of wellness travel, and I do a number of keynotes myself and I've been highlighting a lot of the stats from Virtuoso that you know, then 23 and 24, it was really one out of four. One out of five trips were wellness trips, and there's so many different exciting aspects to wellness travel, so I'd really kind of like to open up the conversation to you on that topic. Given, wellness travel is on the rise, what are some of the trends that you're seeing in this space?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So, as we know, the topics like transformative travel, purposeful travel, meaningful travel, slow travel and even responsible travel have been on the rise, so those all fall under the umbrella of wellness.
Speaker 1:We turn to travel for very specific reasons, and there's always a motivating factor for why we want to get away, and they tend to fall under those, whether it's for human connection, whether it's for boosting our mental wellbeing, reducing stress.
Speaker 1:So wellness travel has it's continuing to grow, but it's going to shift in a way where it becomes more of a holistic approach to wellness travel beyond the typical wellness resorts and hotels and yoga retreats that we hear so much about, because there's so many different ways that we can benefit wellness-wise from travel, whether it's emotionally, mentally, physically, spiritually, socially and more even professionally, and so we're going to be seeing more depth into what does a transformative trip look like? What does immersing into a local culture really do for us? Why would giving back to a local community and traveling more responsibly and choosing a more ethical type of experience what does that do for us? Volunteering volunteerism as well. So all of these things fall under this category of wellness. So I think being able to see this bigger scope of wellness tourism is kind of the direction we're going and kind of using travel as a source of therapy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's interesting I'm over the last few years, with the pandemic and obviously the return of travel, wellness being a main theme, and yoga, which you alluded to. Certainly I have a number of friends that have gotten into yoga during that time, and one school friend who I still stay in close touch with and she is a single mom and got really into yoga and she decided to go to Nicaragua with her yoga group. She's not traveled really outside of the USA and Canada and all of a sudden she was going to Nicaragua, a place she would never go to otherwise, or at least it wouldn't be one of the first places, and she had the most incredible time and she's basically planning to go wherever the yoga group goes next. So these are some of the emerging changes in the travel space, and so one of the things I wanted to ask you, given this, I guess, combination of personal wellness and wanderlust, I'm kind of intrigued by those two elements coming together.
Speaker 2:How do you see the travel industry, I guess, better supporting travelers or people interested in traveling to combine those two? What are some of the resources that you go to or some of the trends that you're seeing? I know there's a terrible term with leisure like business, and leisure travel right, there's no good term for that but people are traveling. When they're traveling for work, they're also looking to do something, and oftentimes it is going to a spa or going to a retreat and tacking something on. So how do you see that trend evolving?
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, we hear things like mindfulness sabbaticals as well. So, whether you're in the corporate space, integrating that so taking a sabbatical or really utilizing your vacation days effectively and companies getting around, that is something that I've always had an interest in talking about boosting our company culture by encouraging our employees to take vacations and to actually take them effectively, not just to go home or to waste them away or working while you're on a trip. Right, there's a lot of digital detoxes that we hear too in the wellness space, but I think when it comes to the difference of like wanderlust or wellness, travel or personal wellness, I think they really do overlap. Again, it goes back to the roots of we travel for very personal, emotional reasons the majority of the time, even if we travel for business. There's a reason why we got into a company that enabled us to travel for business. It's very enticing, it's attractive. Who doesn't want to travel, right?
Speaker 1:But the business travel world is a whole different monster when it comes to business travel and burnout and what we can do in the wellness space, especially beyond just the four walls of an establishment and you know, a fitness center or yoga, and that's usually what I talk about when I talk about as a wellness travel coach.
Speaker 1:But just as, overall, we're going to see people turning to travel as, like I said, a source of like therapy, a source of connection, a source of healing, whether they book an intentional wellness trip through you know what we see in the wellness travel on these different websites and booking sites or just to get away, and you know, go on an explorer or go on a multi-generational trip and the benefits of what that can do for us as well, all fall under these umbrellas of wellness. So I think being able to play around with these different types of wellness travel beyond just putting them wellness tourism or wellness trips into the boxes of spas and wellness centers and all of these that tend to cost a bit more money, which gives people the idea that they can't actually have a wellness trip, when in reality, travel is wellness and wellness is travel.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm glad you brought up mindful travel, because I actually that is a concept that I don't think is as well understood. I mean, people hear the term mindfulness and it's becoming more commonplace, so I think most people listening to this probably have an idea of what that means, or think that means to them, but I would actually like to hear what it means to you. So if you wouldn't mind explaining what mindful travel is and how you would suggest that travelers practice it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a great question.
Speaker 1:Actually, there's various definitions of mindful travel, depending on who it's coming from, what the source is, but as a whole, mindfulness is really just being present.
Speaker 1:So in the Travel Coach Network, when we talk about mindful trips or taking mindful travel experiences, you have to set intentions for your trip, be aware of why do you want to get away, what are you looking to get out of this trip, how do you want to feel? And then, when you're in that environment, when you're on that trip, how can you be present, how can you really take in all that you are experiencing? Because travel can do that for us. These different destinations, whether it's the sights, the sounds, the smells, the languages, the cultural experiences, the nature, the power of blue and green spaces, all of these can benefit us and help us in a variety of ways. So, whether people integrate the more traditional techniques of mindfulness, like yoga or meditation or deep breathing, or they just really practice being present and allowing travel and a trip to really do what it can, it's proven to be able to do, based off of decades of research out there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's really interesting, and there's a book that I love and this is a pure travel book called the Art of Travel by Alan de Paton, who is a philosopher, and it's one of my favorite reads. But one of the things that he highlights to your point is you can't take a vacation from yourself and many people my wife and I had both read the book and there was many things that resonated with us about when you're landing at a destination and that transformation that should occur when you're in a new destination. That is almost like intoxicating, like a drug, right that you are, you know it's a completely new environment and all this new stimulation intoxicating like a drug, right that you are, you know it's a completely new environment and all this new stimulation. And I'm sure you, similar to me, if we're both the passionate travelers, I have a common, not only bond or understanding of what that is. But then you find people that are at a hotel or resort and you just overhear they're just they're complaining about work or they're just like. We'd hear people in the pool or, and it was just like, and we'd often look at each other and say you just can't take a vacation from yourself. You know people are you're? You're not at work, you're here in this tropical place, you're in Fiji. Why are you like? And so, um, I think this is a very important topic, which is why I wanted you to just express that, because so many people whether it's um, you know still having their smartphone when they're traveling and access to social media, and those dopamine hits that everyone craves from constantly being connected, and that is obviously partly what's causing this kind of erosion of truly feeling connected and being present, to your exact point about truly what mindfulness means.
Speaker 2:So I got one other question for you on this particular topic, just because you can speak to it so well is some of the other practical tips that you would suggest for travelers looking to incorporate and I'll give you one that I do and you can tell me if this is because I am so addicted to my smartphone. I try to take digital detoxes, but really it can be incredibly challenging. Even the idea of being away from your phone can cause even more anxiety, and so I try and do like a one check in or I try to manage it when I'm trying to actually have time off, but one of the things that I do. This is my, this is my travel hack or my mindfulness hack is I actually set a timer on my phone, um, where I can't look at it for a set period of time, and I struggled with this for a while because I would set it for a period, I would check it three times or four times in the first 10 minutes, but gradually you have to wean yourself off of it, so that for me, I've noticed that if I set a timer, or I set and give myself a block out amount of time and just I'm not even going to look at it, I'm not going to think about it.
Speaker 2:Gradually, each time I do that, as I'm starting a holiday, it gets easier and easier 10 minutes, 30 minutes an hour and you start to become less reliant on that. So that's anyway something that I utilize. So, but I'd love to hear your tips for the people listening to this how can you apply mindfulness in your travels?
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's two things that come into mind mindfulness in your travels. Yeah, there's two things that come into mind. One is for people to first be aware of their behaviors and what are your distractions typically, because that looks different for everybody, right? So, if you know that you tend to look at your phone more often, or that you're always thinking about work for whatever reason, or you know we all have different distractions, so being aware of what those are and then setting goals like you set for yourself there, so finding some little hack that works for you. But something that I think that is really grounding when traveling is to journal.
Speaker 1:Journaling can really put us into a place of self-reflection and really taking in what we're experiencing, what we're hearing, how we're feeling, and that really can allow us to take advantage of that trip and what it's actually doing for us, and it can bring awareness to how much more work we have within that. So are we not enjoying it that much because we're still being distracted? So how can we amp up our mindfulness within that, our presence being more present, really acknowledging where are we and why are we here on a trip? So that you can. When we hear transformative travel, there's a reason. Travel can really do wonders for us. It's why we want to get away in the first place and go on a vacation, but setting those intentions and being more intent you know not to use the word a lot but intentional and mindful on what you're doing with your time and where your mind is at and journaling, I think, would be a really powerful tool for that.
Speaker 2:That's an excellent suggestion and that's certainly along the lines of if you can't sleep and rather than looking at your phone, just pull out the journal and write down notes, and so you're not stimulated, and it's very much a passive medium rather than an active medium. So that's an excellent suggestion because I think so many people have kind of moved away from the idea of writing travel journals with blogs and with digital tools, so going back to pen and paper is a great suggestion and so, yeah, that's terrific. I would also be really keen to know what has been one of your most transformational travel experiences and, I guess, why that was.
Speaker 1:I would say well, the first one that comes to mind is I obviously had several over the years, but the first one that comes to mind is when I was in the Philippines. I was heading to the Philippines of my first time in Southeast Asia and I first flew into Japan, then I went to Taiwan and I forgot the year. But this is the year that the super typhoon went through the Philippines, part of the Philippines, part that I was going to fly into. So I had all these budget flights already booked and that was when I learned that mistake. But I actually ended up getting hurt at the time so I had to fly home. So when I was home on bed rest for about a month, I was researching how I can still get back to the Philippines and because I didn't ever have a purpose when I was traveling, I had time, so I wanted to find a way, how I can go and help in some way, and I found a group that was getting together some volunteers to be able to help on a specific island that got hit pretty hard. It had a lot of schools and farms on it. So I reached out to them and said how can I get there? I want to help. You don't need to pay for anything, just tell me how to get there. So I did.
Speaker 1:I flew to Cebu, philippines. I made my way all the way along the border, got on a ferry, got to this island. The weather was still terrible. The island was absolutely destroyed. It looked like a tornado hit it. Everything was absolutely destroyed. It looked like a tornado hit it. Everything was just destroyed, and the weather was still really really bad, flooding everywhere.
Speaker 1:So I lived on this island for a little over a month and just helped with whatever we could help with Helped with distributing food, rebuilding, we did debris clearing, we built outdoor classroom areas for the teachers to teach the kids and just really just helped with a lot of different things.
Speaker 1:And it was during that time that I realized it showed me the value of just humanity, not the value of humanity, but the people were so kind, so welcoming, so joyful, so happy, despite having not very much to begin with, and then that all got taken away and they were still so given and they wanted to feed us.
Speaker 1:They always thanked us, they gave us shelter, they gave us warmth, and I ended up revisiting that island two years later and I made my way, all the way back to the Philippines, in the same island two years later, and saw how much it was thriving. It had a new opportunity to grow with tourism. It finally had tourism, which it didn't have before. All these new developments, new restaurants, just everything. And I saw the same exact people, the same exact locals and they remembered me, the kids remembered me, and it really set my heart on fire of just falling in love with not only the Philippine culture and the people, but just putting a lot of things in perspective for me that I take with me throughout my life and when I came back home, that's really fascinating.
Speaker 2:I'm glad I appreciate you sharing that because for many of us, as you alluded to, you likely have a few transformational stories and we're also going to hear today your best travel story ever, which we'll come to. But one of the things I really wanted to get your take on is the role of travel advisors. Going forward and especially given the conversation of wellness and I'll kind of set the stage for my question by giving it context to two other interviews we've done on the show we had Lauren and Chris Pronger. Chris Pronger, of course, a very famous Hall of Fame hockey player who I knew of and watched growing up, and he's joined his wife's company. Lauren Pronger is a wellness coach and expert and they've built an incredibly successful wellness business based out of St Louis and they were amazing guests on the show and I've seen them at the Virtuoso conference.
Speaker 2:And there was another lady I interviewed at the Forbes Travel Summit earlier this year, a lady named Eli Wagner who runs a company called Wagner Bespoke Travel and her focus is wellness and she used to be a corporate lawyer a really incredible story as well and she actually left the corporate world.
Speaker 2:She was a corporate entertainment lawyer and she actually worked on Jeopardy and so she had this kind of fascinating kind of backstory and decided to give that all up, to give up her legal career and step away from entertainment, because she loved travel and wellness specifically.
Speaker 2:So the question I'm coming to is there seems to be this overwhelming connection between wellness and travel advisors and from my vantage point, having had these conversations, one of the things that I see is that there is that strong desire for a human connection that if you are looking to do a wellness trip, you want someone that is going to recommend a place and an experience that is going to be personalized, that is going to be really curated to you and your needs, whether it be dietary or your fitness regimen and there's so many unique aspects to that that it requires a high level of personal touch.
Speaker 2:And so when I actually look at these businesses I look at Eli's business and I look at Chris and Lauren's Pronger's business they're all new. They're new to travel advisors and new to being in this travel agent space, and I've spent nearly 20 years in this industry and it used to be the big concern that travel advisors were going away and all indications are their businesses are thriving in the face of AI and other technologies, and so I would love to get your take on how you see the travel advisor role evolving in the next, let's say, five years, and even seeing how it's evolving today with some of the travel advisors that you're coaching and that are part of your network.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, there's always been an evolution of the travel agent role, right? The travel agent turned travel advisor, no matter what title they have now term. The evolution pointed to more of a lifestyle guru, shoulder to lean on, and then, of course, planner and person who creates the itinerary and books the trips for you. So they are wearing more hats than ever before, and that's why it's been a perfect fit for travel agents to organically come into the Travel Coach Network, because they're like I feel like I've been coaching people or how do I amp this up a little bit more here and put more of my own personal spin on this? But therefore, like I said, it's always been this evolution in the travel agent space. But what we're seeing now is people going from what I've heard is wanting less of more of this transaction when planning and booking trips and less of putting themselves into these niches and boxes that the industry has kind of had them check, and more of helping people use travel as this vessel or this medium for transformation, for wellness, for connection, whatever goals they have in mind personal or professional goals and therefore that's going to impact the way that we plan and book trips. Something I talked about in the Travel Coach Network is what I call destination or experience matching, and we're seeing more of this. It's actually I heard about this during a world travel forum back in 2020, I believe it was and this individual, he was part of a big investment company and he said, if he's going to invest anywhere, it's going to be in the wellness space. But he mentioned about experience, choosing experiences first, and this is something that I do talk about in the Travel Coach Network and instead of taking a destination and saying, look how beautiful this beach is, book now, go here, how popular this destination is, now, go here, how popular this destination is, instead, flipping that around and really getting to know the individual on.
Speaker 1:Who are you? What are you going through right now? What are you going through in your personal life mentally, physically, emotionally, like? What is causing you to want to get away? Where are these desires to escape or to get away coming from? What are you trying to run from? What are you trying to get away? Where are these desires to escape or to get away coming from? What are you trying to run from? What are you trying to get towards?
Speaker 1:When we can really pull these answers to the surface as travel agents, then they can make better planning and booking decisions for their clients.
Speaker 1:And that's what we're seeing more of is, instead of saying, here, here's a wellness trip for you, you can do this treatment, this spa, this exercise class and whatnot, but turning it around and saying, well, seems like my client, instead of thinking they need to go to Paris, which is a popular city, wanting to see the Eiffel Tower the friends have been there said it was great and I love it as a travel agent Instead saying, maybe because they recently lost their grandmother and they are nearing burnout in their busy job and they're a mom who never puts themselves first and takes care of everyone else before themselves, maybe time in nature is what they need.
Speaker 1:Maybe it is someplace like Bali where they can have more of a spiritual journey, they can immerse in the local culture and they can take a look at those wellness experiences, so those local traditions and techniques that wellness brings in that local community. So it's a way to flip around how we are promoting, marketing and selling trips and really tapping into this hyper personalized, tailored, customized experience and why you need that human connection and personal touch.
Speaker 2:It's in the word. One of the things I wanted to ask you about with the coaching program itself was that clearly you probably see a common list of challenges, and one of the things I think would be helpful for our listeners is understanding how you actually coach people to overcome those challenges, because I'm sure a lot of the focus is trying to actually help people develop their skills and become either more assertive or be able to manage objections, and ultimately one of the benefits at least I understand of coaching is to build up that self-esteem. And so what are some of the common challenges that you see amongst clients that come in and how do you help them overcome those?
Speaker 1:Are you talking for the challenges of coaches?
Speaker 2:Yes, exactly. Well, yeah, as a well, as a leader in travel, coaching yourself, um, when you're, when you're doing your coaching, um, I'm just keen to know what some of the challenges that people are coming to you with and how you help them navigate those.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it kind of I have to unravel everything that they have been taught prior. So and this goes back to just when we think of someone having a travel business, your mind automatically is going to go to being a travel agent, and that's not at the roots of what we do as a travel coach. The Travel Coach Network is not a travel agency and we don't train travel agents as a travel coach. The Travel Coach Network is not a travel agency and we don't train travel agents. It's a whole different process and certification, accreditation and training. But a lot of them have gone that route because, like I said, they felt like that was the only option for them, or this is how the training that they've been told or what they read about, and so it's really unraveling all of the.
Speaker 1:Find your niche, choose your demographic. This is how you market yourself, this is how you're going to sell trips, this is how you're going to get commission and upsell, and so one of the biggest challenges is having them understand that or figure out what their niche is. Who can you serve? How can you tap into your truth about travel? How has travel impacted you, transformed you, benefited you, and what got you into this industry in the first place? Why is it that you are so inspired to help others take trips? Why, what does that look like and who needs to hear that? So working on them with that is what I find one of the challenging parts is they can't grasp the concept not that they can't, but it's hard for them to grasp the concept that their truth matters on how travel is beneficial to them and how they can help someone go through a similar process or similar journey or transformation like they have had.
Speaker 1:Versus I have to put structure of a niche that I've heard about. I have to choose Disney. I have to choose luxury. I have to choose wellness. Those are very broad terms like wellness. Where do you fit within that? How can you create a business that is really truly lights you up, that you're passionate about and feels good to you? Versus what I hear them always say is I just don't want to. I'm tired of being so salesy, I'm tired of just feeling like I'm making a transaction with my client. I really want to be a part of their journey with them.
Speaker 1:So, of course, we touch on or teach the fundamentals of coaching and the ICF coaching through that of asking those powerful questions beyond what again their program to ask of where do you want to go? What do you like to do? Where have you gone in the past? How many people in your party? What's your budget? What type of activities do you want to go? What do you like to do? Where have you gone in the past? How many people in your party? What's your budget? What type of activities do you like to do? What are your interests? Those are very surface level questions and those when people answer that that tells them, that tells us, as travel professionals, nothing about what travel, why they want to go on that trip and what travel could do for them. So, breaking down those barriers mentally around how they're used to planning trips and helping people go on their own journeys and really getting to the root of who they are as a human being and now using that trip to really help them reach whatever specific goals that they have in mind.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's really interesting, especially given that you certainly mine up background is not in coaching. So I'm keen to ask you all of these questions, especially given that you know what would be. My understanding of the role of a coach would be to not only educate but inspire, and, and so that very idea of trying to inspire others, which clearly comes natural to you and some people obviously get energy from other people and, and especially if you're helping them, obviously that's how do you keep yourself inspired, though? That's something I'd love to know. I mean, because clearly I'm sure you have days where you've coached and you must be drained.
Speaker 2:So and then you're getting on to the next day. So yeah, how do you keep yourself continually inspired?
Speaker 1:day. So, yeah, how do you keep yourself continually inspired? Yeah, so I, let's see, I don't do I was gonna say I don't do as much that much coaching because I work in a group setting, so I serve our coaches in group settings, so it's not as many one on ones, but I do juggle quite a bit of projects in our place of growth here within the Travel Coach Network. But that's a great question. What inspires me is I love reading articles, I watch webinars, I'm on various companies' newsletters so I like to see what's going on, what events.
Speaker 1:So, kind of like yourself, I listen to a lot of podcasts, whether it's travel-related or business or even mindset-related. Whether it's travel related or business or even mindset related, those things inspire me. I'm someone who, just like in my journey of traveling, I believe that everything happens when it's supposed to and I just enjoy the journey, enjoy the process, accept the process, and so I get to a point where I'll know energetically that I need a boost of inspiration. So I go into what I call like my research phase and I will absorb whatever content that I can and that will something will give me a boost of inspiration or new ideas or help me get over whatever mental hump I was facing, roadblock I was facing at that moment, and then I'm good to go for the next stretch.
Speaker 2:I got a couple last questions for you. One of them is for all these listeners that are now considering a career in travel or coaching for that matter, what advice would you offer?
Speaker 1:them. Well, first come to the Travel Coach Network to learn more. We have a lot of really great free resources to get started on their own of how to combine coaching into what they do. Because what I always say is, just because coach is in the term, travel coach does not mean that you have to work one-on-one with people. Travel coaching is something that can be integrated easily into any travel profession, whether you are a travel agent, advisor, tour operator, retreat leader, medical expert or more life coach.
Speaker 1:But I would just say what is it about travel that you believe so deeply in that you want others to also believe in and know about, and who needs to hear that? I think that is something that a lot of people miss, because in the travel space, as a travel expert, professional of any sort, it's easy to say, well, I can serve everyone, I love travel, everyone loves travel. But from a business standpoint, that makes no sense. It's not strategic. You have to figure out who are you serving, what are you all about? What do you want to be known for? What is your message? Because travel, we all have a different message about travel and really tapping into that is something I find a lot of you asked me before what do my coaches struggle with? Another is really tapping into how travel. What is their why for travel? What is their why for travel?
Speaker 2:The other thing I wanted to ask you too, along these exact same lines, for someone coming into this industry or looking to rise up in this industry, is the power and importance of mentorship, and I've certainly seen that in my experience, especially with female mentorship. There's a number of terrific organizations, you know future female leaders, hospitality. There's a number of team members I've worked with in Australia there's that belong to a mentorship program called time and and so, and even within my corporate experience I mean, there was a outstanding team member based in South Africa. Her name is Carly and Parsons. She was part of our digital team and she really wanted to learn more about the wider business and she had a few people that she wanted to be mentored by beyond just working within our team, and I was able to connect her to two of the senior female executives in the business and uh, and she's continued to thrive and I think that that's.
Speaker 2:You know, I've been raised by a single mom, so the the female element is obviously important, but I mean, when it comes to mentorship, I mean that applies to everyone and I guess that's where I guess it doesn't have to be specific to female leaders, but those people, how important is mentorship Because, I don't know, across the board you hear people sometimes asking about getting a mentor, but it almost feels like more like the same likelihood of someone's going to get coaching, and there's probably a lot more people out there that need coaching, that don't realize it, and there's probably a lot more people out there that would benefit from having a mentor. So, when it comes to mentorship, how would you suggest that people listening to this approach that who should they ask? What resources should they reach out to?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a great question. First, I'll also say that I, too, was raised by a single mom, but I am a big fan of mentorship as something I tell my coaches all the time. Mentorship is key to any success that you have. When I started out my business, and even before I had clarity on what I wanted to do and what did this look like, I found a mentor. I first started working with David Meltzer from Entrepreneurcom's Elevator Pitch. He's in the sports marketing industry. He has nothing to do with travel, but I resonated with his values. I found him on Instagram. He was amazing. He was my very first mentor. I learned so much from him I to this day. I just had a call the other day with another mentor of mine.
Speaker 1:I have worked with countless mentors women, men in all different industries. I am someone who I like to work smarter, not harder, but also people. It's really important to learn from others' experiences. You can find mentors who have done something you want to do, you aspire to do, in anything it could be. How did they get media wins? How did they build and sell their business? How did they get to that corporate level that they got to? Whatever it is that you strive to do.
Speaker 1:I really recommend that people find a mentor and there's a lot of great resources and you'd be really surprised who's willing to help you. I've worked with mentors I've just met throughout the business travel industry or I connected with them and I said, do you mind if I hop on a call with you I can ask you a few questions? You'd be really surprised at how willing people are to help you. Or you can something I learned from my mentors say do you know anyone who would be able to help me and they can point you in the right direction, kind of like you're able to do for that person. Or there's also an organization in the US called SCORE S-C-O-R-E which is a free and I've had several mentors through that, which is really makes it super easy to kind of narrow down what specific pain point you have that you need help with. But I would highly, highly, highly recommend anyone and everyone to get several mentors throughout their business journey.
Speaker 2:Those are so many insightful points. Sahara, it's been such a pleasure having you on the Travel Trends podcast. I really hope we're able to keep in touch. I'm certainly going to be tracking your journey. I want to make sure, as we sign off here, that people do know how to connect with you, how to learn more. I know you've mentioned a few resources as we've been having our conversation, but, yeah, please make sure that everyone can know where to find you, what actions they should take next, and thanks again for being a part of this conversation today.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I can visit us at the travelcoachnetworkcom or the Travel Coach Network across all of our platforms. Or me. I am Sahara Rose, the travel coach, on all of the social platforms, or Sahara Rose DeVore on LinkedIn.
Speaker 2:Awesome, that's great. Thank you so much, sahara. Thank you Thanks so much for joining us on this latest episode of Travel Trends and our special spotlight episode featuring Sahara Rose DeVore, the founder and CEO of the Travel Coach Network. For more information about the Travel Coach Network, check out thetravelcoachnetworkcom. Thanks again for joining us, sahara, and to each of you for tuning in for this special spotlight episode. If you're tuning in for this special spotlight episode, if you're interested in more conversations like these, then I definitely encourage you to check out traveltrendspodcastcom slash spotlights, where we do special features on executives, companies, destinations and events. Now our season six starts in september, so make sure you're registered on the streaming platform of your choice to be notified when new episodes go live and sign up for a monthly newsletter at TravelTrendsPodcastcom. Until next time, safe travels.
